N8BMB
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You don't have to like it, you just have to do it!
Posts: 48
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Post by N8BMB on Feb 14, 2005 11:43:31 GMT -5
The ARRL has petitioned the FCC to take its broadband over power line (BPL) Report and Order (R&O) back to the drawing board. In a Petition for Reconsideration, the League called on the Commission to "reconsider, rescind and restudy" its October 14, 2004, adoption of new Part 15 rules spelling out how BPL providers may deploy the technology on HF and low-VHF bands. Arguing that the R&O does not take into account the technology's potential to interfere with Amateur Radio and other licensed services, the League called the FCC's action to permit BPL "a gross policy mistake." The R&O, the ARRL said, "represents a classic case of prejudgment" by an FCC that knew better but ignored evidence already at its disposal.
You can view the League's Petition for Reconsideration in ET Dockets 03-104 and 04-37 on the ARRL Web site.
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Post by KD8ATI on Feb 21, 2005 4:01:31 GMT -5
Dennis,
Hey for those of us who arnt really for sure, would you mind summerizing what "broadband over power line" and "Report and Order" is?
Thanks - 73,
Shannon
KD8ATI
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Post by KC8UKM on Feb 21, 2005 8:50:53 GMT -5
Broadband over Power Line is a means of delivering high speed internet access via your regualr power lines, to try to take business from the phone and cable compaies that currently provide it. It serves no real benefit, except maybe to bring another competitor to the scene, and maybe to serve those where phone service does not reach. However, it is delivered via unshielded power lines that radiate RF. The frequencies allowed to it include every HF ham band, as well as WWV. If the signal is strong enough, it can disrupt VHF and UHF amateur communication as well, via harmonics. For a definition on Report and Order, check FCC procedures.
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Post by KD8AQO on Feb 22, 2005 10:57:49 GMT -5
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Post by va3css on Feb 22, 2005 12:50:04 GMT -5
to try to take business from the phone and cable compaies that currently provide it. It serves no real benefit, except maybe to bring another competitor to the scene, and maybe to serve those where phone service does not reach. Although I've heard some phone companies say the same thing, the real truth is there are many areas, outside of major metropolitan areas, where DSL high-speed is not available. This is due to very old lines and switching stations for the phone lines. The phone companies don't want to foot the bill for new equipment, because they feel that there aren't enough customers in those areas to make it "worth their while." Those areas also lack cable TV service, most often, so that's not an option either. Enter the idea of BPL - a method of sending high-speed internet over existing power lines, without changing any equipment. So while it may seem that BPL is trying to take business away from the phone companies, the truth is BPL is trying to fill a void created by the phone companies and their unwillingness to make changes in some areas. It's like: if you had a store, and refused to carry a product for a customer, and then that customer goes to your competition to get it, you shouldn't complain that your competition did what you refused to. That said, I sincerely hope that BPL is not allowed to continue. In one test of the system in Canada, BPL was interfering with local emergency communications. I hope it continues to do that in more tests, because there's NO WAY the local governments will allow their ambulance squads or fire crews to have to battle through BPL noise.  Down with BPL!  |
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Post by KC8UKM on Feb 23, 2005 9:22:26 GMT -5
That said, I sincerely hope that BPL is not allowed to continue. In one test of the system in Canada, BPL was interfering with local emergency communications. I hope it continues to do that in more tests, because there's NO WAY the local governments will allow their ambulance squads or fire crews to have to battle through BPL noise. Down with BPL! I agree, down with BPL. Around here, the FCC has required that BPL not interfere with TV,government, police, fire or ambulance communications, and has required that the power companies notch out the frequencies used by those entities. It seems that nobody else wanted BPL in their frequencies either, which shows the accuracy of the ARRL's field testing. Hiwever, the FCC did not afford us any protection, leaving us to deal with BPL. KC8UKM |
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Post by va3css on Feb 23, 2005 13:59:39 GMT -5
Hiwever, the FCC did not afford us any protection, leaving us to deal with BPL. KC8UKM See, that's the part that makes no sense to me. I mean, is the FCC even interested in the ham community anymore?? Do they care? And what about the ARRL's testing methods - did they test accurately enough? Neither seems true, does it? |
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Post by KC8UKM on Feb 24, 2005 8:55:56 GMT -5
And what about the ARRL's testing methods - did they test accurately enough? Neither seems true, does it? Well, from what I understand, the FCC verified the accuracy of the ARRl's testing. Despite the accuracy, the FCC sided with BPL. It may very well be a mandate. KC8UKM |
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Post by va3css on Mar 9, 2005 14:33:59 GMT -5
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N8BMB
Moderator
You don't have to like it, you just have to do it!
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Post by N8BMB on Mar 10, 2005 4:30:01 GMT -5
No, now wait! It doesn't state, by your quote, that the interference is caused by BPL. It is well known that powerlines and transformers (especially if they are near the end of their life) can cause interference. Is this a BPL case? Don't know, you don't state so......
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Post by va3css on Mar 10, 2005 8:23:22 GMT -5
No, now wait! It doesn't state, by your quote, that the interference is caused by BPL. It is well known that powerlines and transformers (especially if they are near the end of their life) can cause interference. Is this a BPL case? Don't know, you don't state so...... You're missing my point. I'm not claiming that this is a BPL case at all. What I'm asking is why is it that the FCC will go to bat for a ham in MO who complains about interference from electrical utilities, but seems to not have a problem pushing BPL? |
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N8BMB
Moderator
You don't have to like it, you just have to do it!
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Post by N8BMB on Mar 10, 2005 13:02:34 GMT -5
Well, then, that's easy to answer. The reason is this type of interference IS NOT a BPL interference issue. If it were, you can bet your sweet bippy the FCC would ignore the complaint! See, the power lines and transformers are not to emit RF interference in and of themselves while transporting electricity. BPL is a case where the lines are used to carry a braodband RF signal, such as what cable does. Of coarse, we all know that sending RF through an UN-sheilded wire causes lots of RF interference. But with BPL being Georgy's pet project, the complaints that BPL will incur will be looked at modestly and not in the full aspect if it were some other type of interference. Therefore, the FCC will still look into cases of interference that ARE NOT BPL related and will basically turn a blind eye when it is related. Remember that Georgy and good ol' Mikey (Colin Powell's son) are PROMOTING this technology and want to get it working so that the electric companies can get in on the ISP thing. Lots of money out there to be had! The other and most over-looked portion of this BPL issue is this - the government will be able to track your habits at home through BPL.  YES, KIDDIES, THAT'S RIGHT! Your fridge, microwave, internet, TV, VCR, DVD habits, all in the same way that software makers incorporate Spy-Ware into their programs, the future holds the same possibilities with future home appliances. Don't think it won't happen? Let BPL exist and find out! |
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Post by va3css on Mar 10, 2005 14:08:31 GMT -5
Therefore, the FCC will still look into cases of interference that ARE NOT BPL related and will basically turn a blind eye when it is related. Then my point stands. They are hypocrites. The reasons why (money to be had, whatever) are irrellevant. The other and most over-looked portion of this BPL issue is this - the government will be able to track your habits at home through BPL. YES, KIDDIES, THAT'S RIGHT! Your fridge, microwave, internet, TV, VCR, DVD habits, all in the same way that software makers incorporate Spy-Ware into their programs, the future holds the same possibilities with future home appliances. Don't think it won't happen? Let BPL exist and find out! Really! Do tell! Please explain further... |
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N8BMB
Moderator
You don't have to like it, you just have to do it!
Posts: 48
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Post by N8BMB on Mar 10, 2005 17:17:06 GMT -5
I don't think I need to explain, I think your imagination would be able to do just fine.
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Post by va3css on Mar 10, 2005 19:19:49 GMT -5
Well, if you're talking about the supposed method of tracking everyone via the internet, I'd say it's more wishful thinking than anything. Besides, if that's what they want, they could do it now with your cable or DSL internet, couldn't they? Good Luck! |
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YES, KIDDIES, THAT'S RIGHT!